.

they definitely are the worst ones out there.

maybe this was one too many claims denied

drummerboy said:

they definitely are the worst ones out there.

maybe this was one too many claims denied

"I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore!"

It certainly wouldn’t surprise me if the perpetrator was someone who had problems with medical expenses and United Healthcare. We’ll only know when he’s caught. 

I haven’t been following the story too closely other than to know the search is ongoing. The image released by the police is pretty clear but the guys hair and face are mostly covered. It looks like they’re going to have to track him down in other ways. 

Given that this was a wealthy white guy I am sure the case will get plenty of attention and resources from the NYPD. 

mrincredible said:

Given that this was a wealthy white guy I am sure the case will get plenty of attention and resources from the NYPD. 

You cynic, you....

Major clue: The words, "deny, defend and depose" were found etched on the shell casings found at the scene. 

I wonder if it means anything. 

Hmmm.

"Deny Defend Depose" is the title of a book about abuses in the health care insurance industry.

The_Soulful_Mr_T said:

mrincredible said:

Given that this was a wealthy white guy I am sure the case will get plenty of attention and resources from the NYPD. 

You cynic, you....

Already has.

Wondered yesterday about the health care connection.  Shell casings nail it (if true)?

eta: full disclosure, our family has had 2 kinds of United Health coverage for going on 10 years with no problems beyond the usual US health care meshugass.  Looks like others have had bad experiences with them.

mjc said:

Already has.

Wondered yesterday about the health care connection.  Shell casings nail it (if true)?

eta: full disclosure, our family has had 2 kinds of United Health coverage for going on 10 years with no problems beyond the usual US health care meshugass.  Looks like others have had bad experiences with them.

United is considered to be most most consumer unfriendly in the business. Your experience has been positive. Keep in mind, they can't deny all claims. Next illness for you or someone else in your family - maybe not so lucky.

Formerlyjerseyjack said:

United is considered to be most most consumer unfriendly in the business. Your experience has been positive. Keep in mind, they can't deny all claims. Next illness for you or someone else in your family - maybe not so lucky.

can't Like, but absolutely agree.  definitely a "so far so good" situation, to cross over into the movie thread

these events happened in the following order:

1. Anthem Blue Cross announced a new policy in CT stating that anesthesia coverage would be denied if the operation ran longer than Anthem's arbitrary time limit.
2. UHC CEO is murdered.
3. Anthem Blue Cross withdraws the new policy.

pursuant to my previous post:

tbf, the anthem thing is probably more of an example of how the cost of our healthcare is at the mercy of both profit-driven insurers and doctors who demand exorbitant compensation. regardless of who's more guilty, we pay the cost.

A big insurer backed off its plan to pay less for anesthesia. That’s bad.

What the fight between Anthem and anesthesiologists was really about.

Also, UHC was using A.I. to filter and deny claims. 

Next up on the 'added security' list: CEOs of A.I. firms. 

drummerboy said:

pursuant to my previous post:

tbf, the anthem thing is probably more of an example of how the cost of our healthcare is at the mercy of both profit-driven insurers and doctors who demand exorbitant compensation. regardless of who's more guilty, we pay the cost.

A big insurer backed off its plan to pay less for anesthesia. That’s bad.

What the fight between Anthem and anesthesiologists was really about.

Interesting. Especially that the physicians did not publicize their position.

dave said:

Also, UHC was using A.I. to filter and deny claims. 

Next up on the 'added security' list: CEOs of A.I. firms. 

Interesting side issue to the topic of A.I. 

One of the original researchers/developers of A.I. was a resident of South Orange and later Maplewood. Bill Gale worked at Bell Labs. One time, I asked him what he was working on. His response was the equivalent of if I was sitting next to Einstein and asked him what HE was working on.

Einstein: "Well, JJ, you take the speed of light and divide it by the gravitational pull of the universe. Throw in some dark matter and add a black hole or two. Then we go back to the spee ----

JJ: "That sounds interesting, Al. Let me know if you find anything."

It was about the same with Gale.

Then, about 6 months ago, I was curious about this new stuff, Artificial Intelligence. Looking it up on Wiki, there was Gale's name as one of the original developers.

drummerboy said:

pursuant to my previous post:

tbf, the anthem thing is probably more of an example of how the cost of our healthcare is at the mercy of both profit-driven insurers and doctors who demand exorbitant compensation. regardless of who's more guilty, we pay the cost.

A big insurer backed off its plan to pay less for anesthesia. That’s bad.

What the fight between Anthem and anesthesiologists was really about.

Also, many (most?) of the doctors are for practical purposes controlled by large corporate or "nonprofit" entities, regarding what services they offer and what is charged.  Going back a ways, it must have been very attractive to docs to affiliate with an organization that would take care of all the business side of the practice - billing, publicity, facilities....  And here we are. 

Don't know about NJ, but here in Wis, it seems as though an awful lot of the health care is in the hands of 3 or 4 organizations (plus some regional ones?).  And that's not counting whatever contract companies are employing the docs in ERs.  Also don't know what the situation is for anesthesiology - or who owns/operates the increasingly huge facilities. Some have plaques by the elevator giving the name of the owner/operator company, but i don't remember it.  Profit motive is about more than insurers and individual docs, and as in so many areas, increasingly complex and obscure.  Not serving us well imo.

CEO shooter used fake NJ ID with a Maplewood address on Sherman Place!

rcarter31 said:

CEO shooter used fake NJ ID with a Maplewood address on Sherman Place!

Motherf*cker.

mjc said:

Also, many (most?) of the doctors are for practical purposes controlled by large corporate or "nonprofit" entities, regarding what services they offer and what is charged.  Going back a ways, it must have been very attractive to docs to affiliate with an organization that would take care of all the business side of the practice - billing, publicity, facilities....  And here we are. 

Don't know about NJ, but here in Wis, it seems as though an awful lot of the health care is in the hands of 3 or 4 organizations (plus some regional ones?).  And that's not counting whatever contract companies are employing the docs in ERs.  Also don't know what the situation is for anesthesiology - or who owns/operates the increasingly huge facilities. Some have plaques by the elevator giving the name of the owner/operator company, but i don't remember it.  Profit motive is about more than insurers and individual docs, and as in so many areas, increasingly complex and obscure.  Not serving us well imo.

The nephrologist I use, bounced from office to office over a period of 10 or so years. Four years ago, he was accepted by Summit Med. I asked if he liked it.

"I have reached Nirvana."   He didn't mean the band,

The service I receive from him is still good. My bp is 120 or lower (except when I see Trump's puss on a screen.)

Formerlyjerseyjack said:

mjc said:

Already has.

Wondered yesterday about the health care connection.  Shell casings nail it (if true)?

eta: full disclosure, our family has had 2 kinds of United Health coverage for going on 10 years with no problems beyond the usual US health care meshugass.  Looks like others have had bad experiences with them.

United is considered to be most most consumer unfriendly in the business. Your experience has been positive. Keep in mind, they can't deny all claims. Next illness for you or someone else in your family - maybe not so lucky.

we had United Health care through the exchange starting about six months ago. And that was enough for us. Starting Jan 1 we'll have a different insurer.

UHC was awful. Their in-network provider list for certain specialities is almost non-existent, the premium was high, and the deductibles and co-pays were high. They don't cover some common prescriptions, so even with insurance I'm using GoodRX for one of my prescriptions. And to top it off, they raised the premium for next year by 20%.

It's almost like not having insurance with all the out-of-pocket costs. And this was without any of us having any serious illnesses or injuries. How bad must it be to get them to pay for costly procedures if they make it hard just to get reimbursed for a routine visit to an ENT?

It's terrible that Thompson was murdered in cold blood. I wouldn't want to do any violence, but if Thompson was still alive, I would have loved to tell him to go **** himself.

nohero said:

Motherf*cker.

he looks like he could have participated in the Chalamet look-alike contest.

Luigi Mangione from maplewood??? Related to Mario from south orange? 
this shooter is highly intelligent. Professional killer. Left a lot of misleading clues. Military experience likely. 

Seems Luigi Mangione is from a well-to-do family in Maryland. Went to a private (all boys?) high school, and was the valedictorian. Went to UPenn for his Bachelor's and Masters (possibly in computer science). 

Lived in Hawaii for a bit, where he worked remotely, and may have gotten spinal misalignment due to a serious surfing injury. Had surgery in 2023. Was in pain. Indicated to a friend that he was unable to be intimate with anyone due to the back misalignment. Perhaps he went down the route of self-medication, or perhaps it was just the pain, which will be part of the 'explanation'.

But none of that explains how one ends up with a fake ID that is so close to a real address that even a local wouldn't necessarily notice the address didn't exist?

Formerlyjerseyjack said:

United is considered to be most most consumer unfriendly in the business. Your experience has been positive. Keep in mind, they can't deny all claims. Next illness for you or someone else in your family - maybe not so lucky.

A lot of UHC's most egregious denials are for Medicare Advantage plans. 

mjc said:

drummerboy said:

pursuant to my previous post:

tbf, the anthem thing is probably more of an example of how the cost of our healthcare is at the mercy of both profit-driven insurers and doctors who demand exorbitant compensation. regardless of who's more guilty, we pay the cost.

A big insurer backed off its plan to pay less for anesthesia. That’s bad.

What the fight between Anthem and anesthesiologists was really about.

Also, many (most?) of the doctors are for practical purposes controlled by large corporate or "nonprofit" entities, regarding what services they offer and what is charged.  Going back a ways, it must have been very attractive to docs to affiliate with an organization that would take care of all the business side of the practice - billing, publicity, facilities....  And here we are. 

Don't know about NJ, but here in Wis, it seems as though an awful lot of the health care is in the hands of 3 or 4 organizations (plus some regional ones?).  And that's not counting whatever contract companies are employing the docs in ERs.  Also don't know what the situation is for anesthesiology - or who owns/operates the increasingly huge facilities. Some have plaques by the elevator giving the name of the owner/operator company, but i don't remember it.  Profit motive is about more than insurers and individual docs, and as in so many areas, increasingly complex and obscure.  Not serving us well imo.

yeah, out here in Ohio, at least in the northeast Cleveland/Akron area, there are 3 or 4 healthcare borgs that are absorbing all of the private practices. Sometimes absorbing each other. One of the bigger ones has just been bought by some other outfit. I've seen a bunch of doctors since I've been here, unfortunately, and only a few have been independent practices.

That's not necessarily a bad thing though, not for me anyway. I happen to be very lucky and have excellent insurance between Medicare and Aetna (medicare supplemental) , so I don't see the effects of any higher costs. Not directly anyway. I rarely even get a bill once my deductible is met, which I usually accomplish by February or March. And it's convenient to have different specialists under one online portal so I can easily see my records, communicate with them, etc.

Anyway, high costs via high doctor compensation has long been a problem for the U.S. and has set us apart from the rest of the world for many decades.

The_Soulful_Mr_T said:

mrincredible said:

Given that this was a wealthy white guy I am sure the case will get plenty of attention and resources from the NYPD. 

You cynic, you....

You’re absolutely correct. 

To be fair, this is not just on the police. They get a tremendous amount of scrutiny from city government as well as the media for cases like this.

At any rate, it was a remarkable effort to find this guy. I don’t know how many murder cases get a $50,000 reward offered almost immediately, and I honestly don’t know how many detectives were assigned to going through security camera footage and photographs to put together the pieces. But I am willing to bet that your average murder victim in New York City does not get nearly this kind of attention.

Yes, a CNN analyst with ties to the NYPD estimated that about 1000 police officers were assigned to the case in various roles, including going through all the video and so on.  

mrincredible said:

You’re absolutely correct. To be fair, this is not just on the police. They get a tremendous amount of scrutiny from city government as well as the media for cases like this.  At any rate, it was a remarkable effort to find this guy. I don’t know how many murder cases get a $50,000 reward offered almost immediately, and I honestly don’t know how many detectives were assigned to going through security camera footage and photographs to put together the pieces. But I am willing to bet that your average murder victim in New York City does not get nearly this kind of attention.

Jasmo said:

All right I’m glad they caught the guy but clearly this was special treatment. 

mrincredible said:

Jasmo said:

All right I’m glad they caught the guy but clearly this was special treatment. 

ya think?

mrincredible said:

The_Soulful_Mr_T said:

mrincredible said:

Given that this was a wealthy white guy I am sure the case will get plenty of attention and resources from the NYPD. 

You cynic, you....

You’re absolutely correct. 

To be fair, this is not just on the police. They get a tremendous amount of scrutiny from city government as well as the media for cases like this.

At any rate, it was a remarkable effort to find this guy. I don’t know how many murder cases get a $50,000 reward offered almost immediately, and I honestly don’t know how many detectives were assigned to going through security camera footage and photographs to put together the pieces. But I am willing to bet that your average murder victim in New York City does not get nearly this kind of attention.

you're not imagining anything.

New York Times Runs Dozens of Stories About Slain CEO – But Hasn’t Covered the Killing of Teenager in Possible Hate Crime Just a Few Miles Away

Two Killings in Manhattan a Day Apart, and the Gap in The New York Times’ Coverage of Them Might as Well Be Measured in Light-Years

One day after UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson was gunned down in Midtown Manhattan on Wednesday, a group of men stabbed two migrants in Lower Manhattan, one of them fatally. Before the attack, they reportedly asked their victims if they spoke English.

Four days later, The New York Times has not run a single story about the latter killing. Meanwhile, the Times has published at least 40 stories about Thompson, his suspected killer Luigi Mangione, and related matters such as the reactions to the killing and corporate security. That’s an average of about seven stories per day.

I wonder if this dumb bastard even knows that he didnt even get the actual CEO of UNH.